On a recent episode of the Jack Hibbs Podcast, Pastor Jack Hibbs sat down with Dr. Erwin Lutzer to confront what they describe as America’s accelerating drift toward socialism and its spiritual implications.
Hibbs opened the conversation with a sober reflection on the “shocking” political and cultural decisions emerging across the nation. For him, these trends are not merely economic or governmental—they are deeply spiritual.
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Dr. Lutzer discussed how the the popular appeal of “democratic socialism” is dangerously misunderstood. “Socialism can never make money; it can only spend it,” Lutzer explained. Using his pie analogy, he illustrated that once the pieces are distributed, nothing remains to replenish the system.
Both pastors recounted firsthand experiences with communist Eastern Europe, describing empty shelves, lifeless architecture and a culture drained of incentive and joy. Hibbs recalled an elderly woman in Moscow grabbing his face and weeping with gratitude that the gospel was once again being preached after decades of communist suppression. Lutzer shared memories of Russian factories manufacturing shoes no one could wear—products made not because anyone needed them, but because the state continued paying workers regardless of usefulness or demand.
They argued that socialism inevitably produces corruption because individuals are not rewarded for hard work but must instead “game the system” simply to survive. Lutzer pointed to bartering networks and underground economies—everyday people trading potatoes for home repairs, or covertly using American dollars despite government prohibition.
Hibbs warned that similar patterns are emerging in the United States, where heavy taxation and expanding government control stifle creativity and entrepreneurial drive. He described writing a successful book only to see much of the fruit of his labor consumed by the state of California. “It sucked the creativity out of me,” he admitted—not because of greed, but because such policies prevent believers from directing their resources toward charitable or gospel-centered work.
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Lutzer took the conversation into deeper philosophical territory, citing Karl Marx’s own writings. He noted that Marx advocated abolishing private property, eliminating inheritance and establishing a so‑called “democracy” after destroying prior structures. But at the core of Marx’s vision, Lutzer argued, lies a false view of human nature. Marx believed human beings could be perfected if oppressive systems were destroyed—a belief Lutzer says collapses the moment we acknowledge the reality of sin.
Hibbs and Lutzer expressed deep concern for the future of America—not simply economically, but spiritually. The debate over socialism vs. capitalism, they argued, is ultimately a debate about truth, morality, responsibility and the nature of humanity itself. And at the center of that debate stands the gospel.
Abby Trivett is a writer and editor for Charisma Media and has a passion for sharing the gospel through the written word. She holds two degrees from Regent University, a B.A. in Communication with a concentration in Journalism and a Master of Arts in Journalism. She is the author of the upcoming book, The Power of Suddenly: Discover How God Can Change Everything in a Moment.
Spot on. Praise God for imparting wisdom through these folks, to bring light to dark moment. May the grace of our Lord Jesus, the Christ, be shed on us; and may the hearts of our nation be turned to repent of sin and find saving faith in Him.